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Anonymous 11/18/14(Tue)01:14 UTC+1 No.5740595 Report

>All I know is that I know nothing

Err, Socrates, you're claiming to know that you know nothing. So how can you say that you know nothing? What a moron.

Plato was a hack.
>>
Anonymous 11/19/14(Wed)00:26 UTC+1 No.5745072 Report

>>5740595
Socrates? More like Operation Ivy
get bent retard ska faggot
>>
Anonymous 11/19/14(Wed)00:21 UTC+1 No.5745050 Report

That's too literal of an interpretation.

What he actually meant is something like this: "In this contemporary climate of know-it-alls, I want to make sense of whatever knowledge there is currently under the sun! So, let us argue: you tell me something you know and I, in all of my ignorance of the subject, will try to find objections to it and we will see where the dialectic, or the argument, leads us."
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Anonymous 11/19/14(Wed)00:14 UTC+1 No.5745020 Report

>>5740611
>implying socrates was trying to teach wisdom
>mfw that was the one thing socrates was trying to avoid teaching
>mfw socrates was trying to teach that wisdom is subjective to perception
>mfw everything is subject to perception
>even perception
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Anonymous 11/19/14(Wed)00:08 UTC+1 No.5745006 Report

>>5740595
see this.
>>5744993

as well as; OP it is a criticism on what 'knowing' truly is/means.
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Anonymous 11/19/14(Wed)00:04 UTC+1 No.5744993 Report

>>5740611
How is that a logical fallacy? I think you are inaccurately examining the statement kind sir.
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Anonymous 11/18/14(Tue)15:06 UTC+1 No.5743243 Report

>>5741077
>was really a cunt. He targeted people who were just living everyday life without questioning reality
You mean the kind of people you want to start thinking since they aren't already? That's being a cunt, trying to make people realize that there are questions that are worth considering rationally, especially if you're to vote in a democracy?
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Anonymous 11/18/14(Tue)23:36 UTC+1 No.5744916 Report

>yfw you realize what a moron is

oh
m
gee
>>
Anonymous 11/18/14(Tue)23:39 UTC+1 No.5744923 Report

>>5741077
sauce for socrates' criticizing heraclitians?
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Anonymous 11/18/14(Tue)23:43 UTC+1 No.5744934 Report

It was meant to be a paradox.

I myself am partial Carneades' dictum "Nothing can be known, not even this."
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« ????????? » 11/18/14(Tue)03:46 UTC+1 No.5741373 Report

>>5740595
>Err, Socrates, you're claiming to know that you know nothing. So how can you say that you know nothing?
Autismal

Feed him to the Spartans!
>>
Anonymous 11/18/14(Tue)04:04 UTC+1 No.5741443 Report

I don't know if I don't know or if I know if I know or not, so I will remain silent.

>Ataraxia unlocked
>freedom from desire unlocked
>pain threshold maxed

Socrates a shit
>>
Anonymous 11/18/14(Tue)03:41 UTC+1 No.5741354 Report

>>5741288

it's supposed to be valid, it's only worded like this because it sounds better than what >>5741077

wrote in the last sentence, but he basically captured what Socrates meant "I don't know anything except that this statement is true." Paradox no more.
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Anonymous 11/18/14(Tue)03:26 UTC+1 No.5741288 Report

>>5740598
>it's supposed to be bad
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????? 11/18/14(Tue)02:48 UTC+1 No.5741082 Report

>>5741039
Yes, only that's not quite what Socrates' position is. His position is that there is no one in the city who knows less about any given topic than he does, and that everyone knows more about something than he does, according to the Apology. Not that he literally knows nothing, just that's he's more ignorant than everyone else save in one respect, which is realizing his ignorance. Supposedly the oracle said Socrates was the wisest man in Greece, and he couldn't figure this out for a while, since he apparently know about as much as Bill and Ted, until he finally came to the conclusion that wisdom was knowing yourself, and most people overestimated their knowledge of things they had no knowledge of, whereas Socrates didn't
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Anonymous 11/18/14(Tue)02:47 UTC+1 No.5741077 Report

>>5740900

This is because Socrates, apart from being intellectual powerhouse, was really a cunt. He targeted people who were just living everyday life without questioning reality. Professionals, not thinkers. He obviously made fun of the intellectual elite as well, mainly Heraclitus students and scholars as he hated their "everything flows" mantra and recognized that everything was flowing for them because they didn't establish definitions of concepts they discussed, under illusion that things do not exist independently from human perception.

About that quote which is your gripe OP - it's only poorly formulated. Perfect formulation would be: "I don't know anything except that this statement is true".
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Anonymous 11/18/14(Tue)02:41 UTC+1 No.5741039 Report

>>5740598
Ironic paradoxing is still paradoxing.
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Anonymous 11/18/14(Tue)02:09 UTC+1 No.5740883 Report

>>5740595
Socrates knows nothing except how to speak
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Anonymous 11/18/14(Tue)02:14 UTC+1 No.5740900 Report

>>5740595
everyone in Athens hated Socrates: imagine you are working your day, trying to sell some of your goods in the Agora and this old crazy man come near you and wasted half of your day telling you are doing something wrong. and the he leaves without buying anything.
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????? 11/18/14(Tue)02:39 UTC+1 No.5741028 Report

>>5740716
As I have said before, Plato's portrait of Socrates isn't consistent. A good amount of the time it's the Socrates who rational and skeptical, in other dialogues you have this quasi spiritualist making dubious claims about he nature of true knowledge.

This is the distinction I think must go to Aristophanes: his Socrates depiction was contemporary with the actual Socrates, so likeness, if ridiculously caricatured, was essential in order for it to be funny. Whereas Plato's Socrates was written after Socrates had died and does not depend on likeness at all. There COULD be likeness, but that's not the point of the dialogues, but likeness is the point of Aristophanes sophist Socrates.
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Anonymous 11/18/14(Tue)01:41 UTC+1 No.5740716 Report

>>5740669
Aristophanes' Socrates was a sophist in the worst sense. It is safe to say that Aristophanes didn't really know well Socrates (at least, the one who Plato tried to portrait). He wanted someone who could incarnate his critiques about sophistry ("intelect over faith is bad") and Socrates was a public figure seen everyday in the streets disturbing people. The other sophists most likely worked for rich people and really didn't stay a lot of the time in the same place. Aristophanes needed some who were apt to be joked about and also be criticized. Socrates was who he found.
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????? 11/18/14(Tue)01:30 UTC+1 No.5740669 Report

>>5740660
Again I stress that this particular characterization of Socrates is not uniform, it's just one used in many dialogues. In other dialogues, Socrates sets out to teach. We can't really know which characterization used by Plato corresponds with the actual Socrates, although Aristophanes' characterization might be an indicator even though it's a caricature.
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????? 11/18/14(Tue)01:28 UTC+1 No.5740660 Report

>>5740647
Why I say he wasn't trying to teach wisdom, is because you can't really teach his idea of wisdom, wisdom is knowing yourself as you are rather than as you fancy yourself to be. You rock the foundations of knowledge to get people thinking along that path, but ultimately self knowledge is a matter of acknowledgement. To teach it would be as idiotic as trying to 'teach' someone atheism.
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????? 11/18/14(Tue)01:26 UTC+1 No.5740647 Report

>>5740611
Socrates wasn't trying to teach wisdom, at least the character which said that. There are several versions of Socrates, but that was the one who very seriously asserted that he knew less than everyone else, and that his primary wisdom was in realizing he was an idiot in every respect, whereas everyone else was smarter than he was in something, but they didn't see where they were idiots. Wisdom for Socrates (that characterization) means realizing what you don't know, not necessary thinking 'you can't know nuffin'. 'You can't know nuffin' was a position held by some of Socrates' contemporaries, and Socrates is illustrating that it's a paradox with a wink, he's not siding with them.
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Anonymous 11/18/14(Tue)01:25 UTC+1 No.5740643 Report

All I know is that Bardot was hot as fuck.
Checkmate maieutist.
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Anonymous 11/18/14(Tue)01:19 UTC+1 No.5740616 Report

Socrates has been dead for millenia and he's still trolling niggas softly
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????? 11/18/14(Tue)01:15 UTC+1 No.5740598 Report

It's intentionally a paradox
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Anonymous 11/18/14(Tue)01:18 UTC+1 No.5740611 Report

>>5740598
>attempts to teach wisdom via intentional logical fallacies

ok
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