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/vr/ - Retro Games

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Anonymous 06/24/14(Tue)17:17 UTC+1 No.1712546 Report

Was gaming more kiddie in the past?

Nowadays you have these M rated juggernauts like Mortal Kombat, The Last of Us, and Call of Duty being well known titles. Gaming is full of 'mature' games.

Compared , 30 years ago seems pretty tame. When you think of arcades games like Street Fighter and Pac-man come to mind. With the NES you have a bunch of platformers and stuff, same with the Genesis. It wasn't until the mid 90s that more late teen games became more console mainstream.

I collect games so I've seen my fair share of titles and most 2600 through SNES games probably wouldn't be above a Teen nowadays. PC gaming is a different thing.
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Anonymous 06/24/14(Tue)17:31 UTC+1 No.1712565 Report

The console and PC market line of titles became very thin lately due to multiplat games being a literal clone in each platform.And with the graphics advancing,it was more reasonable for the devs to look for a more realistic appeal than improve on the cartoon ones.Besides,the whole taboo surrounding violent video games like mortal kombat as you said was a great marketing tool and kids loved it because it was so prohibited.
There were many aspects in play really,but it all comes down to kids liking violent games,it wasn't so noticeable back then because devs tried to stay theme to not cause much uproar from families and religion institutions,but with the time they started to push more the boundaries and nowadays we have video games with child soldier.It will not be long till we see rape simulators in the maistream media.
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Anonymous 06/24/14(Tue)17:32 UTC+1 No.1712568 Report

>>1712546
>Was gaming more game-oriented in the past?

Yes.
>>
Anonymous 06/24/14(Tue)17:40 UTC+1 No.1712583 Report

>>1712565
> The console and PC market line of titles became very thin lately due to multiplat games being a literal clone in each platform

I blame the Xbox.
>>
Anonymous 06/24/14(Tue)17:45 UTC+1 No.1712590 Report

>>1712565
devs tried to stay tame*
fucking auto correct
>>
Anonymous 06/24/14(Tue)18:02 UTC+1 No.1712619 Report

I've thought about this before, and I think part of it is just the natural result of the more advanced graphics.

If you think about it, your average FPS is just a modern version of Contra. God Of War is like a modern Rygar, etc.

The older games were not supposed to be kiddy, they just looked like that because the graphics limited the realism of the violence.
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Anonymous 06/24/14(Tue)18:10 UTC+1 No.1712632 Report
File: 3[1].jpg-(125x93)
Yeah arcade games were totally...
Yeah arcade games were totally tame 30 years ago
>>
Anonymous 06/24/14(Tue)18:37 UTC+1 No.1712682 Report

>>1712565
>It will not be long till we see rape simulators in the maistream media.
At least in the US, sexual stuff is a lot more taboo than violence. Games with plenty of violence like GTA are hugely popular, and even Mortal Kombat whose sole niche is its brutal deaths isn't looked down upon much anymore. Games in the recent Senran Kagura series, which is basically fanservice in game form, get a lot of negative press because of it. It was the same with Dragon's Crown. I hear that it is the opposite in Japan, though, with God of War games being censored and given a higher rating there.
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Anonymous 06/24/14(Tue)18:46 UTC+1 No.1712695 Report

>>1712546
Gaming was more cartoony and fun. "Fun" is a loaded term, but hopefully you get what I mean. Now it's more of a race to see who can be the most realistic, gritty and grimdark. Mortal Kombat is edgy as shit now, but was actually kind of goofy back then.

>>1712565
>It will not be long till we see rape simulators in the maistream media.
We can't get that until people stop flipping their shit at mere dry humping simulators like Hot Coffee. We can be as ultraviolent as we want, but any kind of sex is a big no-no in America.
>>
Anonymous 06/24/14(Tue)19:24 UTC+1 No.1712763 Report

>>1712583
There's no reason to blame Xbox. The point of having console exclusives is something that hasn't really existed for anyone but console manufacturers for a long time now, mostly because we're at the point, and have been for while, where you don't need to program to the specifics of a console to get good graphics and music.
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Anonymous 06/24/14(Tue)20:42 UTC+1 No.1712981 Report

Depends on what you consider "kiddy" and "adult".

For example, one of the first games on PC I played was some edutainment game with Mickey... it was about his birthday party or something, and it was basically "help mickey do the shopping for his party" while learning basic things like numbers, group objects and other things for little kids. I was around 5 or 6 and found it really boring, but played it anyway because it was one of the few games my aunt had on her PC (I didn't have one of my own yet). Then I played Wolfenstein 3D and blew my mind.
But on the NES, I wasplaying things like Super Mario Bros, Circus Charlie, Twin Bee, Contra... and honestly, those weren't neither "for kids" or "for adults", I enjoyed them because they were great games. My dad played them, my neighbor who was 14 played them, they're games for all ages.

I miss the old ESRB rating "K-A (kids to adults)"
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Anonymous 06/24/14(Tue)23:06 UTC+1 No.1713473 Report

>>1712546
Mortal Kombat is one of the least mature games around.
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Anonymous 06/24/14(Tue)23:08 UTC+1 No.1713476 Report

>>1712695
>Mortal Kombat is edgy as shit now, but was actually kind of goofy back then.
You got that shit backwards, bro.
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Anonymous 06/24/14(Tue)23:14 UTC+1 No.1713489 Report

>>1713476
>>1712695

MK was always goofy and humorous, it's just that in our 10 year old eyes, it was brutal and violent as fuck.
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Anonymous 06/24/14(Tue)23:29 UTC+1 No.1713534 Report

>>1712546
>Mortal Kombat, The Last of Us, and Call of Duty
None of those are mature
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Anonymous 06/24/14(Tue)23:34 UTC+1 No.1713548 Report

>>1712546
they were more gamey yes.
Now, gamey is an insult.
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Anonymous 06/24/14(Tue)23:34 UTC+1 No.1713551 Report

>>1713489
>it's just that in our 10 year old eyes, it was brutal and violent as fuck.

...and to the parents. Do you not remember the controversy? It wouldn't have gotten there if adults thought it was Looney Tunes.
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Anonymous 06/24/14(Tue)23:35 UTC+1 No.1713554 Report

>>1713534
>>1713534
>>1713534
THIS
Mature = / = gritty crap
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Anonymous 06/24/14(Tue)23:38 UTC+1 No.1713569 Report

>>1713534
Notice he didn't say mature, but M-rated, and 'mature' with single quotes.
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Anonymous 06/24/14(Tue)23:59 UTC+1 No.1713630 Report

>>1713476
This is the trailer for the latest game. Not sure I'd call it goofy.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ci6lMQNLKZU

>>1713551
It might have just been shocking at the time, especially with the digitized characters. Night Trap was fairly tame, and that got a lot of controversy too.
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Anonymous 06/25/14(Wed)00:09 UTC+1 No.1713647 Report

>>1712546
There are plenty of good natured games nowadays. There were plenty of violent games back then too. All fighting games, shootemups, horror games, they were all violent. It just seems different now because they are all in different perspectives now. First person is king, we have first person beatemups, first person shooters, first person platformers, so on and so forth and graphics have improved a lot too. It was expected of developers to add blood. Every new generation of gaming added more fucking blood. Why? Because the system could handle it and it has always been awesome. Gibbing enemies in Doom really comes to mind. If they had the capabilities back then, shit like Pitfall would have gory animations with alligators biting off legs or your weapon piercing enemies in Joust leaving an opening and a trail of blood. Graphics breed, graphic content.
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Anonymous 06/25/14(Wed)00:21 UTC+1 No.1713668 Report

I still enjoy the writing in Grim Fandango.
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Anonymous 06/25/14(Wed)00:36 UTC+1 No.1713696 Report

>>1713489

This.
It's a modern day Itchy and Scratchy, a parody of a genre(kung fu movies, Big trouble in Little China and such) with added violence for fun, because absurd violence is indeed fun.

Of course if in Itchy and Scratchy the clichèe being played are the cats and mice fights, in MK case it's family revenge, ancient warlocks and such.
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Anonymous 06/25/14(Wed)00:42 UTC+1 No.1713706 Report

>>1713630
Night Trap isn't even in the same boat.The game doesn't really have violence and the only reason it became infamous was because people took (some rather tame) shit out of context.

MK, on the other hand, was controversial in the proper context. People saw a bloody game with murder in it. And that's exactly what MK is.
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Anonymous 06/25/14(Wed)01:05 UTC+1 No.1713758 Report

>>1713706
The point was that it was blown out of proportion because violence in games were so novel. I don't see anybody making a fuss about violence in games anymore even though it's a lot worse and more graphic now.
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Anonymous 06/25/14(Wed)01:17 UTC+1 No.1713780 Report

>>1712546
Check out the thread about games you were scared to play as a kid.
My parents had me playing leisure suit Larry and loom when I was 8. Fuuuck

Wash that shit down with watership down and The Wall
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Anonymous 06/25/14(Wed)01:19 UTC+1 No.1713787 Report

Yes.
Games developed as toys, and even today suffer from it (hence we still call them games). I don't mean to say that games are completely childish, I play them myself, but they could have been the next great art form.
Although there are a few artistic games, and you may well have had a real profound experience while playing zelda or whatever
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Anonymous 06/25/14(Wed)01:45 UTC+1 No.1713854 Report

>>1713787
>even today suffer from it (hence we still call them games)
So what should they be called then?
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Anonymous 06/25/14(Wed)01:50 UTC+1 No.1713869 Report

>>1713854
Yeah I really don't understand what he is talking about. He doesn't want still pictures, but he doesn't want interactivity with animations. Is television/movies what he wants? Who fucking knows, sounds like he legitimately dislikes videogames, but then he also plays them.

>>1713787
I really don't know how to word my confusion, but what did you even expect of videogames anyways? This is bothering me now. Games have always been for entertainment, to pass the time with interactive activities. Certainly videoGAMES would feature similar elements.
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Anonymous 06/25/14(Wed)02:43 UTC+1 No.1713994 Report

>>1713787

>Although there are a few artistic games

Name them
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Anonymous 06/25/14(Wed)02:48 UTC+1 No.1714010 Report

>>1713854
Just as movies are called movies because they have images that move and talkies are movies with audio which allows for talking, games should be called interacties because they have interaction.
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Anonymous 06/25/14(Wed)04:22 UTC+1 No.1714252 Report

>>1713787
The worst thing to happen to games was the people who tried (and are still trying) to turn them into cinema.

>>1713994
Dwarf Fortress
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Anonymous 06/25/14(Wed)04:26 UTC+1 No.1714270 Report

>>1713994
the path, ico
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Anonymous 06/25/14(Wed)04:37 UTC+1 No.1714295 Report

>>1713994
Loom.
MI + MI2.

Backgrounds are just too beautiful for me to handle.
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Anonymous 06/25/14(Wed)05:09 UTC+1 No.1714415 Report

>>1713780

Watership Down is aimed at kids through adults, it's just gritty
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Anonymous 06/25/14(Wed)05:10 UTC+1 No.1714418 Report

>>1714270
>the path
Is this some kind of trick?
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Anonymous 06/25/14(Wed)06:37 UTC+1 No.1714562 Report

>>1714252

>Dorf Fort

2cat! XD

>>1714270

Don't get me wrong, I love ICO, but it's just an escort-based adventure game, not "art". It's gonna need more than that to become pure "art".
Don't know the other one but it looks like one of those indie 2deep4u horror games.

>>1714295
Loom is a pretty graphical adventure game, but art? Sure it has a nice art direction, like ICO, but it's not "art" in itself.
Don't know what MI and MI2 are.
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Anonymous 06/25/14(Wed)06:40 UTC+1 No.1714570 Report

>>1714562
Name something you consider art and explain why.
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Anonymous 06/25/14(Wed)06:42 UTC+1 No.1714576 Report

>>1714562
all 'art' games are 2deep4u indie shit actually, but there's still people classifying them as art games.
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Anonymous 06/25/14(Wed)06:44 UTC+1 No.1714579 Report

>>1714570

My question qs obviously captious.
Any game you like can be considered 'artistic' if you like its art direction, be it "kiddy", "mature" or whatever.
But games are still games, they have artistic elements (music, graphic design, etc) but the main nature of video GAMES is its ludic element, not the artistic one.
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Anonymous 06/25/14(Wed)06:52 UTC+1 No.1714591 Report

>>1714579
>if you play it, it can't be art
Why? Explain, don't just state.

And quit dancing around the demand.
Supply something you consider art and defend it as art.
It doesn't have to be a game. I'm not asking you to name a game you think is art.
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Anonymous 06/25/14(Wed)06:59 UTC+1 No.1714602 Report

>>1714591

Thing is: anything can be art.

>The expression or application of human creative skill and imagination, typically in a visual form such as painting or sculpture, producing works to be appreciated primarily for their beauty or emotional power.

Going by that definition, I guess even Tetris or Super Mario Bros can be considered art. They required skill and imagination to be made, and evoke emotions of all sort to players (maybe not in an emotive way, but playing Tetris or SMB made a lot of people excited, frustrated, happy, etc).

As I said personally, I think any game you like can be considered art -- by you.

Is that enough?
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Anonymous 06/25/14(Wed)07:08 UTC+1 No.1714617 Report

hmm.

Also (sage for not /vr): The Antichamber, Cavestory, Home, Lone Survivor (Both are distractingly Try Hard) Metro 2033, doesn't try quite hard enough, receiver, Spec Ops: The Line, VVVVVV. (Just went through my steam list and picked what's artsy to me right now)
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Anonymous 06/25/14(Wed)07:10 UTC+1 No.1714621 Report

>>1714602
So what makes listening to things and looking at things more artistic than playing things? What is wrong with "ludic elements"?
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Anonymous 06/25/14(Wed)07:11 UTC+1 No.1714623 Report

>>1714621

There's nothing wrong, as I said, anything can be considered 'art'.

Hell, society calls people like Justin Bieber or Hanna Montana 'artists', and the music they do, 'art'. Think about it.
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Anonymous 06/25/14(Wed)07:23 UTC+1 No.1714639 Report

Mortal Kombat is a 20 year old series.
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Anonymous 06/25/14(Wed)20:33 UTC+1 No.1715780 Report

>>1713630
>Not sure I'd call it goofy.
have you seen the gameplay trailers? there's a stage on dock where corpses in water and you can pick them up and chuck them at people. that might sound dark but if you actually see it in action (for one thing the corpses jump out of the water like fish) it's really goofy looking. that's how Mortal Kombat is. if you just describe it, it sounds all edgy as fuck but in practice it's too overblown to be taken all that seriously.
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Anonymous 06/26/14(Thu)00:20 UTC+1 No.1716392 Report

>>1714562
>discussing what constitutes art

This is art
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Anonymous 06/26/14(Thu)00:21 UTC+1 No.1716396 Report

>>1715780

Mortal Kombat is Kung Pow+Big Trouble in Little China but rated R or NC-17.
That's it, with all the teenage humor it means and the homages to old stuff.
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Anonymous 06/26/14(Thu)20:22 UTC+1 No.1718332 Report

>>1715780
Okay, I can see what you're saying.
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Anonymous 06/27/14(Fri)09:33 UTC+1 No.1720325 Report

>B-b-b-b-but Mortal Kombat!

OP wasn't trying to say that blood 'n gritty games didn't exist back then, just that they weren't the major force in vidya like today. And it's true.
You can say it's the better graphics or whatever, but most games today are way less colorful and wacky than most games of the past. Nowadays if you want that you have to turn to Nintendo.
I miss that, if nothing else because there's a lack of variety in style because of it.
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Anonymous 06/27/14(Fri)09:54 UTC+1 No.1720343 Report

>>1720325
>that Spyro world viewer thread
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Anonymous 06/27/14(Fri)10:27 UTC+1 No.1720374 Report

>>1712619
really that's how it is. if you break it down fps' are really just the evolution of beat em ups; a simple game anyone can play that you can sit down with a couple buddies and just run through. both at some point dominated the multiplayer game market

beat em' ups were a lot harder though, out of necessity, you didn't have enough space to fit 30 half hour levels. there also wasn't hand holding because they were (in most cases) linear. modern fps' are moving more and more towards open world environments and most of the populace doesn't find enjoyment in spending most of their time figuring out where they're going.

there will be better games in the future, we're in the middle of an Atari 2600 era. developers are still figuring out what to do with this new technology and every asshole with coding knowledge wants to milk the cash cow.
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Anonymous 06/27/14(Fri)10:42 UTC+1 No.1720394 Report

>>1712546
You could buy custers revenge in stores 30 years ago. Y'know, the game that's a literal rape simulator? Gaming has become less mature and more focused exclusively on 14 year olds.
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Anonymous 06/27/14(Fri)10:47 UTC+1 No.1720404 Report

>>1720343
I have like 3/4 of those saved to be wallpapers later
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Anonymous 06/27/14(Fri)11:01 UTC+1 No.1720421 Report

>>1714617
>That last panel
Yeah because computer programmers are totally artists. Hey I'm an accountant, I guess my spreadsheets could be considered art?
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Anonymous 06/27/14(Fri)11:12 UTC+1 No.1720431 Report

>>1712546
Just because something's not laden with swear words and gore doesn't make it 'kiddie', an example of something that's kiddie would be Blue's Clues. Pac-Man is not. Ms. Pac-Man was the opposite, she was a sex symbol in her own queer way.
>When you think of arcades games like Street Fighter
No you don't. You think of Street Fighter II, which, you can look at the release dates, it came out at around about the same time that Mortal Kombat did.
>PC gaming is a different thing.
Well, a lot of people did game on PC's so you can't really ignore that, especially moreso in Europe with the various retro computers. And there's Atari porn games and stuff like that. Adult games are not new.

But yeah, I would say that there are more "adult only" games now. That's not even a question. That's obvious. But if you wanted to play devil's advocate, you could say that there are also more kiddie games released. There are more games for all audiences, which is a good thing, and the popular ones seem to happen to be mostly violent and mature because that appeals to gamers on some kind of basic evolutionary psychological level.
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Anonymous 06/27/14(Fri)22:27 UTC+1 No.1721385 Report

>>1720421
And in which panel did the comic talk about computer programmers?
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Anonymous 06/27/14(Fri)22:30 UTC+1 No.1721393 Report

Depends. Consoles? Yeah, absolutely. PC? Not really.
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Anonymous 06/28/14(Sat)01:18 UTC+1 No.1721736 Report

>>1714617
This is one of the comics that highlights why I can't really enjoy Penny Arcade. They're funny as hell sometimes but both of them just seem incredibly obnoxious, and when they try to be serious they end up ruining what could have been a very humorous strip.

I don't understand how Jerry considers himself an intellectual when he spews out shit like the last panel. The answer seems very obvious precisely because he presupposes it in the question. He's answered himself by labeling people making a game as "artists" and the process of game development as "making art".
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